Got FRPP 4.10 Gears with Trac-Loc Installed: Have questions

i have traction controle also and so do the gts. its so that you can lose traction when runnin around the city when its raining snowing etc. if i turn it of in the rain i can barly get from a dead stop to moving. idk about others but ive been able to over power it:) other have had the frpp gears installed and theyve had zero noise from them. i would do the break in periode just to be safe. how much was the t loc and the gears? the friction modifier i think is used if they use a petroleum based gear oil. if they use a ford recomended sythentic oil theres no need to have it couse it comes with the friction modifier in it.

I do trust the guy who did the install. He said that "some gears will make noise, some won't". They could be installed the exact same way on 2 different cars and could be 100 percent quiet on one, and noisy on the other.

Don't get me wrong.... It's not HOWLING or anything. It's a faint noise, but I get nervous after reading thread from people with bad installs and excessive whining, which is a sign of a more serious problem.

1. Changing the gear ratio won't hurt the custom tune.

2. Ford's Traction Control works by limiting fuel and spark to the motor to cut power and also applies some braking to regain control. The rear differential works based on physics alone (no computer help).
Here is info off the net:
TRACTION CONTROL is Ford's name for its electronic braking and engine control system that monitors rear wheel slippage and prevents loss of traction when accelerating. If a Mustang has traction control, it must also have 4-wheel anti-lock brakes (ABS). Traction control consists of all the components of the ABS system, plus a powertrain control module (PCM) and a traction control ON/OFF switch. Here's how it works:
When traction control is turned on, the PCM monitors the speed sensors at the wheels and at the transmission and compares rear wheel speed to the car’s road speed. If the rear wheel speed exceeds road speed (loss of traction) the PCM slows the rear wheels until they regain grip. It does that either by applying ABS braking to the rear wheels to slow them down, or by sending less fuel to the engine, which has the same effect.

TRAK-LOK is Ford's name for the clutch-type limited-slip differential that is installed as standard equipment in the 8.8" rear end on the Mustang GT and Cobra. It is a mechanical system. (No ON/OFF switch) The Trak-lok differential includes all the components of an open differential, plus an S-spring and a set of clutches . The S-spring pushes the clutches up against the side gears, which causes the clutches to engage whenever one rear wheel turns faster than the other. In a situation where one rear wheel has little or no traction and the other one has good traction, the clutches engage and provide torque to both wheels. Two wheel burnouts...
The base (V6) Mustang comes with a 7.5" open differential (without Trak Lok) as standard equipment. In the situation described above, this differential will apply all of the car's power to the wheel with little or no traction. That wheel will spin and the other wheel will not. One wheel burnouts...

3. If the backlash was properly set and everything was torqued to spec, going without the friction modifier a day shouldn't hurt anything. However, if it contiues (I wouldn't even let it go a week! Drive it about 50 miles), take it back to have them check it out!

4. There are two different types of FRPP gears. The Motive made gears (which have been known to whine) are followed by "M" in the part #. You want the true Ford made gear. A little bit of whine isn't going to hurt anything as long as install was to spec and neither the ring or pinion had any damage. It's more of an annoyance than mechanical problem. Some Dynamat or other sound proofing material will help cut down on the noise inside the car.

Break In Period: I was told to take it easy for about the first 50 miles by not doing burnouts or quick acceleration runs. That's about all I gave it and I haven't had any noise or problems and they've been in there for 73K miles now

discodave wrote:I do trust the guy who did the install. He said that "some gears will make noise, some won't". They could be installed the exact same way on 2 different cars and could be 100 percent quiet on one, and noisy on the other.

Don't get me wrong.... It's not HOWLING or anything. It's a faint noise, but I get nervous after reading thread from people with bad installs and excessive whining, which is a sign of a more serious problem.

If you don't feel comfortable with it, take it back and have them pull the cover and check them out! Any repudable shop/installer will stand behind their work! If not, there is a shop in Manassas that does real good work with gears! Ask pikuoff, he had a gear install issue from another shop...took it to Manassas and they got him fixed up

kooldawg6 wrote:

discodave wrote:I do trust the guy who did the install. He said that "some gears will make noise, some won't". They could be installed the exact same way on 2 different cars and could be 100 percent quiet on one, and noisy on the other.

Don't get me wrong.... It's not HOWLING or anything. It's a faint noise, but I get nervous after reading thread from people with bad installs and excessive whining, which is a sign of a more serious problem.

If you don't feel comfortable with it, take it back and have them pull the cover and check them out! Any repudable shop/installer will stand behind their work! If not, there is a shop in Manassas that does real good work with gears! Ask pikuoff, he had a gear install issue from another shop...took it to Manassas and they got him fixed up

Definitely, and they told me that too. They said if I'm not comfortable with the noise in a few days to bring it back and they'll open it up and take a look at it. He did say, though, yesterday when he put the friction modifier in he didn't see anything unusual (metal debris, etc.).

kooldawg6 wrote:1. Changing the gear ratio won't hurt the custom tune.

2. Ford's Traction Control works by limiting fuel and spark to the motor to cut power and also applies some braking to regain control. The rear differential works based on physics alone (no computer help).
Here is info off the net:
TRACTION CONTROL is Ford's name for its electronic braking and engine control system that monitors rear wheel slippage and prevents loss of traction when accelerating. If a Mustang has traction control, it must also have 4-wheel anti-lock brakes (ABS). Traction control consists of all the components of the ABS system, plus a powertrain control module (PCM) and a traction control ON/OFF switch. Here's how it works:
When traction control is turned on, the PCM monitors the speed sensors at the wheels and at the transmission and compares rear wheel speed to the car’s road speed. If the rear wheel speed exceeds road speed (loss of traction) the PCM slows the rear wheels until they regain grip. It does that either by applying ABS braking to the rear wheels to slow them down, or by sending less fuel to the engine, which has the same effect.

TRAK-LOK is Ford's name for the clutch-type limited-slip differential that is installed as standard equipment in the 8.8" rear end on the Mustang GT and Cobra. It is a mechanical system. (No ON/OFF switch) The Trak-lok differential includes all the components of an open differential, plus an S-spring and a set of clutches . The S-spring pushes the clutches up against the side gears, which causes the clutches to engage whenever one rear wheel turns faster than the other. In a situation where one rear wheel has little or no traction and the other one has good traction, the clutches engage and provide torque to both wheels. Two wheel burnouts...
The base (V6) Mustang comes with a 7.5" open differential (without Trak Lok) as standard equipment. In the situation described above, this differential will apply all of the car's power to the wheel with little or no traction. That wheel will spin and the other wheel will not. One wheel burnouts...

3. If the backlash was properly set and everything was torqued to spec, going without the friction modifier a day shouldn't hurt anything. However, if it contiues (I wouldn't even let it go a week! Drive it about 50 miles), take it back to have them check it out!

4. There are two different types of FRPP gears. The Motive made gears (which have been known to whine) are followed by "M" in the part #. You want the true Ford made gear. A little bit of whine isn't going to hurt anything as long as install was to spec and neither the ring or pinion had any damage. It's more of an annoyance than mechanical problem. Some Dynamat or other sound proofing material will help cut down on the noise inside the car.

Break In Period: I was told to take it easy for about the first 50 miles by not doing burnouts or quick acceleration runs. That's about all I gave it and I haven't had any noise or problems and they've been in there for 73K miles now

That's great info man! Thanks for the input! I've already got about 110 miles on the break in and about 8 heat/cool periods so I think I'm good to go now.

On a seperate note.... how come when i "quote" you (by hitting the "quote" button, it doesn't put the box around it? i swear, i've had more format issues than anyone in the history of this site. i hit the buttons and they do nothing.

Yea...I had a bad install. They whined like a beeatch that was pretty loud when decelerating. Took it to Excessive and Chris got me fixed up. No noise

I was told about the break in on the original/bad install and I didn't horse around until after 200+ miles. I still had issues. After Chris got his hands on it and fixed it, I think I went racing the next weekend (no break in other than the trip home from the shop and the drive to the strip) and haven't had an issue or noise yet...that's with 30+ 5k+ rpm launches on drag tires!

No clue on your technical difficulties...sorry! Maybe Will can figure that one out...

discodave wrote:On a seperate note.... how come when i "quote" you (by hitting the "quote" button, it doesn't put the box around it? i swear, i've had more format issues than anyone in the history of this site. i hit the buttons and they do nothing.

What browser are you using?

TT_05_Stang wrote:

discodave wrote:On a seperate note.... how come when i "quote" you (by hitting the "quote" button, it doesn't put the box around it? i swear, i've had more format issues than anyone in the history of this site. i hit the buttons and they do nothing.

What browser are you using?

Well, I use Internet Explorer at home and at work. Here at work I can see the boxes. Doesn't make sense. No biggie!

pikuoff wrote:Yea...I had a bad install. They whined like a beeatch that was pretty loud when decelerating. Took it to Excessive and Chris got me fixed up. No noise

I was told about the break in on the original/bad install and I didn't horse around until after 200+ miles. I still had issues. After Chris got his hands on it and fixed it, I think I went racing the next weekend (no break in other than the trip home from the shop and the drive to the strip) and haven't had an issue or noise yet...that's with 30+ 5k+ rpm launches on drag tires!

No clue on your technical difficulties...sorry! Maybe Will can figure that one out...

I'm not sure if I really have technical difficulties really. I can hear the gears, but it's very faint. If I even crack my window I can't hear the gears. Window up, I can faintly hear it.

Where is Excessive? How much did they charge you to fix your bad install? I'm not sure I have a bad install, but I would like to get a second set of eyes on it just to be sure. I didn't spend 1400 bucks to have something go wrong.

If there was a problem, the guys that did my install would make every effort to fix it, but they may not be as good as your guy.

I meant your website difficulties. Will is one of our web gurus here.

Excessive is in manassas va. Not too far away. I dont remember what i paid for the fix b/c I had some other stuff done too. They had to replace all the bearings and seals that were roasted from the bad install tho so it was pretty much like paying for it all to get done again! I think it was around $300 but that included the all the parts, etc.

pikuoff wrote:I meant your website difficulties. Will is one of our web gurus here.

Excessive is in manassas va. Not too far away. I dont remember what i paid for the fix b/c I had some other stuff done too. They had to replace all the bearings and seals that were roasted from the bad install tho so it was pretty much like paying for it all to get done again! I think it was around $300 but that included the all the parts, etc.

Crap, I hope I don't run into that then. I've already paid like 1400 bucks total. They charged my 450 bucks for the install (because of the Trac-Loc) and the rest was all parts and supplies. Hell, they charged me over 100 bucks just for synthetic oil they used, on top of the install charge.

discodave wrote:I do trust the guy who did the install. He said that "some gears will make noise, some won't". They could be installed the exact same way on 2 different cars and could be 100 percent quiet on one, and noisy on the other.

Don't get me wrong.... It's not HOWLING or anything. It's a faint noise, but I get nervous after reading thread from people with bad installs and excessive whining, which is a sign of a more serious problem.

Who did the install and how much was it?

PRO50SC wrote:

discodave wrote:I do trust the guy who did the install. He said that "some gears will make noise, some won't". They could be installed the exact same way on 2 different cars and could be 100 percent quiet on one, and noisy on the other.

Don't get me wrong.... It's not HOWLING or anything. It's a faint noise, but I get nervous after reading thread from people with bad installs and excessive whining, which is a sign of a more serious problem.

Who did the install and how much was it?

I had a shop in La Plata (right past Waldorf) called Custom Performance. They came highly recommended, and I'm sure they did a good install (other than not adding the friction modifier until the next day). It was very pricey though. I was quoted 400 bucks for the install, then it went up to 450 for the labor when I added the Trac-Loc. Additional parts (lubes, etc) ended up being another 150 dollars. Here's the price breakdown:

Labor: 450
Gears: 300
T-Loc: 200
Bearings (from the Ford Dealer): 200
Additional Parts (synthetic lube, etc) 200

Grand Total: About 1350 dollars

I assumed that the labor fee would have included the synthetic lube and didn't know that the parts place I ordered my gears from wouldn't send the bearings, so had to get them from Ford where they were twice as expensive.

^^^WOW

Even just half that for gears is just WOW...

pikuoff wrote:^^^WOW

Even just half that for gears is just WOW...

Yep, those dudes nickel and dimed me to death. Having to buy the bearings from the Ford Dealer sucked and added about 100 extra dollars to my overall cost. Shipping costs were about 50 bucks I think. If I would have gotten everything I needed in the initial shipment, and supplied my own lubricants it would have been MUCH cheaper.

Lesson learned is make you have all the parts you need beforehand. I thought I did, but since I'm not a mechanic I didn't know.

Ouch. I bought my FRPP 4.10's for $130 new on black friday. The bearing/shim kit was $80 and the install w/ lubes is $300

05RedDevil wrote:Ouch. I bought my FRPP 4.10's for $130 new on black friday. The bearing/shim kit was $80 and the install w/ lubes is $300

You got a hell of deal man! So your total price will be under 600 bucks, which is very good.

discodave wrote:

PRO50SC wrote:

discodave wrote:I do trust the guy who did the install. He said that "some gears will make noise, some won't". They could be installed the exact same way on 2 different cars and could be 100 percent quiet on one, and noisy on the other.

Don't get me wrong.... It's not HOWLING or anything. It's a faint noise, but I get nervous after reading thread from people with bad installs and excessive whining, which is a sign of a more serious problem.

Who did the install and how much was it?

I had a shop in La Plata (right past Waldorf) called Custom Performance. They came highly recommended, and I'm sure they did a good install (other than not adding the friction modifier until the next day). It was very pricey though. I was quoted 400 bucks for the install, then it went up to 450 for the labor when I added the Trac-Loc. Additional parts (lubes, etc) ended up being another 150 dollars. Here's the price breakdown:

Labor: 450
Gears: 300
T-Loc: 200
Bearings (from the Ford Dealer): 200
Additional Parts (synthetic lube, etc) 200

Grand Total: About 1350 dollars

I assumed that the labor fee would have included the synthetic lube and didn't know that the parts place I ordered my gears from wouldn't send the bearings, so had to get them from Ford where they were twice as expensive.

Jesus dude! I tried to hook you up w/ my boy in Frederick. I think you got raped, bad Sorry man. Where did you get your gears? I paid 150 for my 4.10's. And 200 bux for gear lube, what else did that include? Don't seem too reputable by forgetting something as simple as friction modifier. I hope you don't use them again. Who highly recommended them? We'll go kick their ass!!!

Di they at least give you a wrap around?

[quote="TT_05_Stang"]Di they at least give you a wrap around?[/quote]

Sad, but no..... Maybe I'll go back in there and ask for one

[quote="PRO50SC"][quote="discodave"][quote="PRO50SC"][quote="discodave"]I do trust the guy who did the install. He said that "some gears will make noise, some won't". They could be installed the exact same way on 2 different cars and could be 100 percent quiet on one, and noisy on the other.

Don't get me wrong.... It's not HOWLING or anything. It's a faint noise, but I get nervous after reading thread from people with bad installs and excessive whining, which is a sign of a more serious problem.[/quote]Who did the install and how much was it?[/quote]

I had a shop in La Plata (right past Waldorf) called Custom Performance. They came highly recommended, and I'm sure they did a good install (other than not adding the friction modifier until the next day). It was very pricey though. I was quoted 400 bucks for the install, then it went up to 450 for the labor when I added the Trac-Loc. Additional parts (lubes, etc) ended up being another 150 dollars. Here's the price breakdown:

Labor: 450
Gears: 300
T-Loc: 200
Bearings (from the Ford Dealer): 200
Additional Parts (synthetic lube, etc) 200

Grand Total: About 1350 dollars

I assumed that the labor fee would have included the synthetic lube and didn't know that the parts place I ordered my gears from wouldn't send the bearings, so had to get them from Ford where they were twice as expensive.[/quote]Jesus dude! I tried to hook you up w/ my boy in Frederick. I think you got raped, bad Sorry man. Where did you get your gears? I paid 150 for my 4.10's. And 200 bux for gear lube, what else did that include? Don't seem too reputable by forgetting something as simple as friction modifier. I hope you don't use them again. Who highly recommended them? We'll go kick their ass!!![/quote]

I think they came so highly recommended because it's the only shop like that around here (southern maryland, waldorf area). I wish I would have taken your advice. I went into it thinking I'd pay 400 bucks for the install, only to get a call saying, "the setup kit they sent you didn't have bearings" so I was forced to get them from Ford since they already had my car on the lift and opened up.

I ordered my gears from Randy's Ring and Pinion. They did have the 4.10s for the 8.8 diff for a hundred bucks less, but everywhere I looked the 4.10s for my 7.5 diff were around 289 bucks. Throw shipping on top of that and the T-Lock and that added about 50 bucks extra.

Well, at least I got all Ford parts.

They said they didn't add friction modifier (by itself) because the gear lube had some already in it. I called Randy's Ring and Pinion (they know their stuff) and they told me that it needs to go in regardless of whether the lube had it in there already.

I think the install was fine other than that. The sound I do hear is very minor and it hasn't gotten any louder after the now 200 miles I have on it after the break in.

I'm going back to that shop at the 500 mile mark and will have them change the gear oil and check for debris particles.

And, what's worse is that at that price I could have gotten the Ford Dealer to do it and had a better warrantee.